Phase Change LGA775 Socket Insulation Guide
05.14.07 - 04:02pm
This is an update to my original Phase Change guide but since it is such a common issue I decided to make it into a mini-article as well. Over the years I’ve gained lots of knowledge on this subject and since Phase Change is one of the top 5 search queries for this website I figured I should devote a little bit of time towards the subject. This particular guide will cover the insulation of an LGA775 socket which is the current Pentium 4, Pentium D, Core 2 Duo, and Core 2 Quad socket used by Intel. LGA775 will be around for atleast another 18 months so this should stay relevant for a good two years. Those of you on s939 can check out the original guide here, AM2 users will have to adapt the concepts within these guides.
Insulation serves two purposes with CPU cooling, keep the moist air out and the cold in. Condensation and the subsequent liquid water is a common killer of phase-cooled computers, you need to properly insulate your motherboard to prevent condensation from forming and killing your hardware. Essentially you have two pieces that you need to focus on, insulating the motherboard around the socket and insulating the evaporator. Since there are as many evaporator designs as there are builders I won’t touch the evaporator insulation, that should be taken care of by your builder. In regards to insulating the LGA775 socket you have many different board layouts and some boards are more easily insulated than others however all boards can be properly insulated.
The temperatures that you will be insulating against will determine exactly how thick you will need to insulate. A standard single-stage will rarely see 240watts @ -40 celsius but some cascades can easily hit 300+ watts @ -100 celsius. Just figure that if you are doubling the evaporator temps then you should atleast double the insulation. For my singlestages I suggest using a foam donut with 1″ thick walls and now the modeling clay of your choice. What purpose does this modeling clay serve you may ask? In the past I preached about using dielectric grease to seal up the socket and form an airtight seal, the problem with this grease is that removing it can be a downright pain in the butt, modeling clay simply peels right off the board. The pictures below show the before and after shots of the socket after the clay has been applied. I find that an inch from the edge of the socket is sufficient for a singlestage, if I were using something stronger then I’d extend this out to 1.5-2.0 inches for safety as the board itself will get cold enough to condense water.
As you can see the modeling clay extends out from the socket and forms a solid barrier against condensation. The foam ring that wraps around the evaporator is compressed into the foam forming a tight seal preventing any condensation from forming. This same concept can be applied to all sockets, just take into account your mounting mechanism and the capacitors around your socket. I’d suggest not cramming clay into the actual socket, I just pressed the clay against the retention mechanism and made sure it formed a tight seal. I’ve been running this system non-stop for 50+ hours and the board is condensation free. When removing the clay I’d suggest warming it up slightly by leaving the board in the sun, this will make the clay more pliable and easier to remove. Be most careful if you laid the clay over any small resistors, you do not want to rip those up otherwise your board may stop functioning.
What type of modeling clay is being used? Where could I buy something like this in the UK? Thanks!
The clay is called Plasticine and I picked it up at a local art store. I bet if you were to look at some Art or sculpting stores you’d be able to find some. It’s advertised as “never-hardening” which is crucial as you don’t want it hardening around components.
Nice guide,
Many builders still use several layers of foam to insulate the board. Do you find the plasticine more effective?
Doesn’t the plasticine get brittle once it’s been frozen?
What condensantion form in the CPU mounting clip?
Well I still use foam to insulate the evaporator and to create a solid seal around the socket so there isn’t any condensation forming within the actual socket or latch. The plasticine itself seems to hold up rather well to the temperatures, after a month I haven’t noticed any issues with it under sub-zero temperatures. I did however run the board with an aircooler and didn’t remove the plasticine which resulted in a slight amount of running in the plasticine near hot components. When under phase the entire area around the socket resides in a sub-zero state, but since these components weren’t being chilled they naturally heated up past the 65*C melting point. Just keep that in mind. In regards to being more effective, I find the clay a better solution than a thick layer of grease as it cleans up better and doesn’t leave a residue.
I managed to find this shop in the UK that sells something similar (hope this is OK?):
http://www.officegiant.co.uk/products.asp?ProductID=LX00123
Is there one main one I should be looking for? Claytoon is the sort of thing I think I am looking for.
That clay you link to should do the trick. Just test it out by putting a layer over the evap and see how it responds to the temperatures. If it hardens/cracks then I’d not use it. This will also give you a chance to see exactly how much you need to insulate the motherboard itself.
Just been thinking my mobo is the EVGA 680i. This one has cap’s lined on top and left side of the cpu socket. Using this type of clay wont be possible for me as the caps will get hot and the clay will run (as u mentioned). I am starting to look into air duct seal. This stuff is pretty temp durable and can withstand the evap temps and the mobo heat temps and the caps temps as well…saw another site where someone actually did this and it does look pretty awesome because it pretty much goes anywhere. Guess the search begins again. I will post up anything useful. I think the guide above is great when u have a clear cpu socket but even the latest P35s have caps around them ruling out the clay method. After killing 1x 7800gtx/evga 680i mobo next time I mount the phase system I want to be 100% sure its all OK and 100% solid.
Ahh ouch, sorry to hear about the VGA/Mobo loses due to condensation. The capacitors actually don’t get hot enough to cause the clay to run, it’s the voltage regulators that get nice and toasty, especially with quad-core chips. Your standard armaflex will always get the job done though, too bad all boards don’t have clean socket areas. I’m wondering if the duct sealant is that rubbery compound I’ve seen some people use to seal their motherboards, seems to peel off rather nicely also. Let me know if you get any more information, always looking for cutting edge sealing techniques.
Hello Chris,
This is what happened. I was too scared to install the phase system myself and got my brother to do it as he’s really good at DIY and making things. He installed the system putting a multiple layers of nail varnish followed by thin layer of vaseline so when the neoprene made contact it was air tight. Overall I think he did everything right. The phase system was leaking from the bottom of the flexline. On my phase system there is a circular piece of neoprene around the end of the flexline to stop condensation. Condensation was leaking from there and under the CPU head.
As both my 7800GTX 256MB died and the mobo as well…I am without a PC and having to do all my work on MacBookPro 2.4Ghz 17″ santa rosa (he bought it for me as BD present in addition to the phase present…spoilt I am). I dont mind the MBP but prefer my PC when working.
Being the totally awesome and nice older brother he is replacing the gpu’s with an EVGA 8800ultra (he picked the card after talking to Gray from exteme systems forums who made the system) and new mobo is the Gigabyte P35 DS6 DDR2. As a bonus I am also getting Corsair PC10000 2GB when it eventually comes out - only after that is he kind of forgiven for making me suffer without my PC for so long.
In the link below is a pic of the compound used by someone for there phase system.
http://www.3oh6.com/forum_posted/0705/planet_insul-1/p5n32-e-2.jpg
Hopefully the people come and read this webpage will have something to go on.
As for the article itself, its awesome but having links to other variations would be nice.
Another thing…just thought I’d mention this in case the link ever dies. The compound details:
Company: Gardner Bender or GB Electrical
Product Name: Duct Seal
Model No.: DS-130 (1Lb PUG /0.45Kg)
Its is black in appearance and ranked No.1 in its type of sealant! Only downside for me is that so far only US sites stock this item. NO-ONE in the UK sells this stuff. There are things similar to it but I dont trust those ones.
Just thought I’d just say that the article is awesome and really appreciate the info.
As for the claytoon method above. Might work for some people but the seal method seems more solid and in my eyes the right one for me.
On a side note. The clay method. Most of them can handle up to -30 temps after which they start hardening slight (no rock solid though).
My method for my next install would be to go overkill and put the seal on the whole mobo and if something happens after that then I just have to accept it :-|
If anyone finds a UK place selling the sealant…put a link please!
Hey I had a couple ideas regarding the modification of your cooling system.
First off, would it be possible to cool multiple components with a single compressor and condenser? I was thinking the use of a splitter for the cap tubes and suction lines would do the trick.
Secondly, I was considering making my case air tight and insulating the inside surface of it as opposed to insulating each line individually. This would provide a cooler ambient temp and would improve overall system performance. Not dramatically, but its something.
Thirdly, I was considering using nitrogen gas instead of CO2. Nitrogen is readily available at indoor paintball fields, but I don´t know what kind of pressure I´ll have to run to get it to liquify. I know the formulas for that kind of stuff, I just haven´t done it yet.
Fourth, I was wondering what kind of noise your rig produces. I was planning on modding my case by putting a container underneath it to hold the compressor and a hole through the bottom for the cap tube and suction line.
Any feedback would be greatly appreciated
@ Mike
Regarding your second thought.*
If you were to insulate your case and get it air tight you would also have to run a vacuum pump to remove all that moisture, and risk of shorting out your mb. Also it would be extremely un conventional to gain access to your components. i am saying this assuming what you meant was basically turning your whole case into an evaporator itself instead of just the cpu block.
Mike,
You can indeed cool multiple components with a single compressor. It just requires running multiple capillary tubes from the condenser and tuning each one to the specific heat. Tuning with 2 tubes can be done but past that it gets to be quick difficult. Making a water chiller is typically the easiest way to guarantee adequate cooling for all components.
Your second point, if you make an air-tight containment for your computer, you could in theory run without any insulation and never form condensation. However, the heat dump from the motherboard, ram, and other components will gradually raise the temperature inside of the container till you reached component failure. A way around this would be to actually chill the air inside of the chamber. I’m designing a chilled air chamber right now to combat moisture and temperatures.
Your third point, liquid nitrogen can be purchased with ease from gas suppliers. Costs range between $1 and $5 USD per liter here in the United States with the average cost running between $1 and $2 per liter.
Your fourth point, single-stages sound a lot like running mini-fridges with a fan. A properly built single-stage will emit the compressor hum and noise from the fan pulling air through the condenser and the case. Your idea is the standard for single-stages, a sturdy case underneath the computer case and the evaporator attached to a flexible suction line snaking into the case.
http://www.overbr.com.br , look my Evaporator. Thanks man. Good job